10 million deaths a year. That is how many people are predicted to die from antibiotic-resistant infections if we do not find new treatments. In today’s episode, Professor Martha Clokie and Professor Tim Spector explore the secret gut viruses, known as phages, being studied to fight deadly infection, target cancer cells, and to protect your gut microbiome. Martha is a world-leading expert on the mysterious phage and, for the last 20 years, has pioneered research to revolutionise the treatment of infections without antibiotics. She explains why antibiotic resistance is a growing global threat, why everyday infections are becoming harder to treat, and how some bacteria are now resistant to every antibiotic available. We explore how the viruses in our gut may help solve this problem, and how scientists may one day use them to deliver highly targeted cancer treatment. By the end of the episode, you’ll have some ideas to help support a healthier gut ecosystem and understand how to increase the number of friendly gut viruses that live inside you. The science is still early, but the message is clear: the small choices we make every day are shaping our long-term resilience to disease. If viruses can help protect us from infection rather than cause it, how much of human health are we only just beginning to understand? 🌱 Try our science-backed and tasty wholefood supplement Daily30: https://zoe.com/daily30?utm_medium=zoe_podcast&utm_source=youtube&utm_campaign=d30 Get our brand-new app and Gut Health Test designed by world-leading gut health and nutrition scientists to build healthy eating habits 👉 Join ZOE: https://zoe.com/buymembership?utm_medium=zoe_podcast&utm_source=youtube&utm_campaign=BAU Follow ZOE on Instagram | https://www.instagram.com/zoe/ Timecodes 00:00 Antibiotic resistance could kill 10 million people a year 01:34 The gut viruses scientists say we need to survive 03:19 There are more gut viruses than stars in the universe 10:50 The billion-year war happening inside your gut 13:10 The hidden system controlling your microbiome 14:42 What healthy microbiomes have that unhealthy guts lose 16:33 The gut viruses that may protect you from infection 17:38 Why your immune system allows trillions of viruses to live inside you 19:25 The natural viruses that kill salmonella 20:52 Why ageing may weaken your gut’s viral defences 22:05 Scientists still don’t know what most gut viruses do 25:12 The strange origin story of phage therapy 27:22 Doctors are already using viruses to treat deadly infections 28:02 Why antibiotics are starting to fail 29:07 The deadly infection crisis bigger than cancer 30:38 How factory farming fuels antibiotic resistance 32:27 The antibiotic resistance emergency is already here 33:25 The forgotten treatment abandoned after antibiotics 35:50 Why phage therapy may spare your microbiome 36:37 The dying patient saved by experimental viruses 39:41 Could phages replace antibiotics in the future? 40:50 The viruses scientists are using to target cancer cells 44:35 How diet shapes the viruses living in your gut 46:05 The surprising link between coffee and gut health 47:25 The foods that may increase healthy gut viruses 50:34 The future of gut health, cancer treatment and infection prevention 📚Books by our ZOE Scientists The Food For Life Cookbook | https://amzn.to/4amfIMX Every Body Should Know This by Dr Federica Amati | https://amzn.to/4blJsLg Food For Life by Prof. Tim Spector | https://amzn.to/4amZinu Ferment by Prof. Tim Spector | https://amzn.to/4hU1Df5 Good Mood Food (preorder) by Prof. Tim Spector | https://amzn.to/4l9oXat Free resources from ZOE: Gut Guide - For a Healthier Microbiome in Weeks | https://zoe.com/gutguide?utm_medium=podcast&utm_source=youtube&utm_campaign=gutguide Better Breakfast Guide | https://zoe.com/breakfastguide?utm_medium=podcast&utm_source=youtube&utm_campaign=breakfastguide Mentioned in today's episode How gut viruses shape your gut microbiome | https://zoe.com/learn/gut-viruses-introduction Phages to the rescue, Trends in Microbiology (2024) | https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0966842X24002270 Compounds in the foods we eat can trigger phage production, Gut Microbes (2020) | https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/19490976.2019.1701353 Microbiomes of garden vs supermarket produce, Nature (2022) | https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-022-05387-5 Phage Therapy at Belgium’s Queen Astrid Military Hospital, Viruses (2019) | https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC6466067/ Habitual coffee intake shapes the gut microbiome, Nature (2026) | https://www.nature.com/articles/s41467-026-71264-8 Have feedback or a topic you'd like us to cover? Let us know here: https://gf6hx47iu5g.typeform.com/topicsuggestion Episode transcripts are available here: https://zoe.com/learn/category/podcasts