Malcolm Gladwell is a staff writer at The New Yorker, bestselling author, and podcaster. Chris Chavez is a journalist and the founder of CITIUS MAG. We discuss the art of the interview, running's culture of secrecy, and why America loses at the sports it thinks it should dominate. READ MORE👉🏼http://bit.ly/richroll1002 ✌🏼🌱 – Rich This Episode Is Brought To You By… Momentous: Get up to 35% off your first order👉🏼https://bit.ly/LiveMomentous2025 Freaks of Nature: Save 20% with code RICHROLL👉🏼https://bit.ly/FreaksofNatureRRP Squarespace: Use code RichRoll to save 10% off👉🏼https://bit.ly/squarespace2025 Rivian: Electric vehicles that keep the world adventurous forever👉🏼https://www.rivian.com Check out all of the amazing discounts from our Sponsors👉🏼https://www.richroll.com/sponsors LISTEN / SUBSCRIBE TO THE PODCAST Apple Podcasts: http://bit.ly/rrpitunes Spotify: http://bit.ly/rrpspotify Google: http://bit.ly/rrpgooglepods Meal Planner: http://meals.richroll.com Voicing Change Book: http://richroll.com/vc Clips Channel: https://www.youtube.com/c/RichRollPodcastClips Newsletter: http://bit.ly/rollcallemail CHAPTERS 00:00:00 Intro 00:00:44 Elite Marathoners in Ultra Running 00:06:11 The Business of Professional Running 00:09:19 Training Transparency in Running 00:16:16 Athlete Personalities and Fan Engagement 00:21:18 AD BREAK 1 00:25:58 The Enhanced Games Experiment 00:29:12 Competition Over Times 00:31:56 The Famous Gladwell vs. Chavez Mile 00:36:25 The Rise of the Masters Athlete 00:40:54 AD BREAK 2 00:43:11 The New Wave of Young Runners 00:55:01 Rethinking Youth Sports Development 00:58:34 The 2024 Track and Field Season 01:02:25 Body of Work vs. Peak Performance 01:12:42 Chris Chavez's Upcoming Book CONNECT WITH RICH ✩ Website - http://richroll.com​ ✩ Rich Roll Podcast - https://richroll.com/all-episodes/ ✩ Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/richroll/ ✩ Twitter - https://twitter.com/richroll ✩ Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/richrollfans ✩ Strava - https://www.strava.com/athletes/14443?oq=rich ✩ Memoir: Finding Ultra - https://www.richroll.com/shop/books/finding-ultra/ ✩ Meals - http://meals.richroll.com​ ✩ Cook - The Plantpower Way - https://www.richroll.com/shop/books/the-plantpower-way-signed/ ✩ Italian! - The Plantpower Way: Italia - https://www.richroll.com/shop/books/the-plantpower-way-italia-signed/ ✩ Support - https://www.patreon.com/richroll Thanks To The Team: Jason Camiolo, Dan Drake, Morgan McRae, Blake Curtis, Desmond Loh * * * * * NEW TO RICH? Hi I'm Rich Roll. I'm a vegan ultra-endurance athlete, author, podcaster, public speaker & wellness evangelist. But mainly I'm a dad of four. If you want to know more, visit my website or check out these two the NY Times articles: http://bit.ly/otillonyt http://bit.ly/vegansglam I LOVE MAIL! SEND IT HERE: 2630 Conejo Spectrum St. Thousand Oaks, CA 91320 #richroll #richrollpodcast